More thoughts on exposure

[Judy Miller]

On Friday, July 03, 1998 6:01 PM, David Gary [SMTP:

dgarystudiosnetwide [dot] net

] 

wrote:

> There ya go, You do alot of things for free and you work your ass off and 

dont

> have alotof time to spend with your family or yourself. Thats sad, noone to 

blame

> but yourself though. :)


> Dont give your time away and you'll get paid _and_ have time to spend with

> your kids. Believe me, Im sure their more important than doing free work for 

someone who

> was nieve enough to get screwed by an ISP.


Actually she was screwed by her best friend which is why I felt so much for 

her.

Hi, I don't want to drag thin on, but will explain since I obviously goofed. 

The 18 hours includes hometime and kids. I guess I shouldn't have called then 

work then eh?? My kids come first, no need to feel sorry for them.


I do get paid for my work. The only reason we still live hand to mouth is due 

to the fact that we are building the business loan free. Purchased tons of 

software and hardware in the past two years. It takes time to build. Loan free 

is a personal choice.

>

> > but I have done web sites for 2 international organizations for

> > free (one of which just offered to pay me well to redo and add to the 

site),


> Im glad they finally paid you. Most business wont.


Finally paid me? No, that wasn't how it was. When I started out, I approached 

them. They are a Canadian organisation for Decorative Arts. I offered to give 

them a free web site for the exposure, both for them and for me.  It was when I 

first started out. Now they want to pay me well to redo it. They also recommend 

me when anyone inquires as to who to go to.


> This is a wonderful story, but is also sad. You evidently need to be educated

> onhow to get away from that "living hand to mouth" thing. If pro-bono work 

for

> profitable organizations is promoted and excepted we will _ALL_ be "living

> hand to mouth".

> Nobody here is saying be dishonest or unfair. Not at all. Just dont promote

> the people who are.

>

> check out www.gag.org and educate yourself now.


I will take a look at this site and I thank you for your feedback. I also feel 

a little embarrassed if I gave you the impression that I ignore my family for 

work's sake, because I don't. I don't have a social life so to speak, but I 

love doing this, so it compensates.


Now, I have a story for you.....listen carefully. I have a friend who is very 

successful in business. Last year, due to some work that he did for a huge 

corporation for free, yes for free and they could have afforded to pay him BIG 

bucks.....he ended up assuming contracts with them that generate 6 digit 

figures every 2 to 3 months on a regular basis and he sums it up to the work he 

did for them for free, so go figure.


> > I am self taught at all aspects of web design,

> This is probably why your still struggling. Education is the key. Please

> listen to whatsome professionals on this list have to say, instead of passing 

it on as

> being "judemental".

> You will learn alot.

>

> These cliches are beautiful, but they're still cliches. The end of the 

rainbow

> is making money youdeserve for learning a skill you have devoted your 

valuable

> time to. This should be so you can spend time with your family. If your 

working eighteen hours a day and are still "hand to mouth", you need to find 

another job or learn how to make it in this industry


Considering that  my business is only 18 months old, and has really only seen 

activity for a year,  I AM getting to the point now, that when people contact 

me about creating a site, I can set my price and am finding them willing to 

pay. I have compared my prices to all ends of the scale and I know that I am 

not cheap. I charge fair for the work I do, and I get it. I complain not, 

especially since I bought an arsenal of software last year. My husband is an 

expert in Authorware. He writes templates that automate what might otherwise 

take a team of coders to develop. We look forward to the time when we can 

implement some Autorware apps into our site as well.


> Gabo's site is a prime example of successful "self promotion". Hes evidently

> bombarded with

> projects because hes promoted himself and noone else. He also happens to have

> great design skills.


I agree, and promoting oneself comes in many forms, sometimes not obvious to 

the naked eye. Have you checked out Macromedia's contest for the Canadian site? 

There are no prizes other than exposure. Is it worth it? Yes, and to some 

people, they may find the other to be worth it as well. I was contacted last 

summer by IBM. They wanted to use a still of my site for a magazine ad. They 

were doing shoots in Nova Scotia and needed a Scotian art site and really liked 

mine. I don't know if the ad ever went to press. I know that they purchased it 

from the team that was doing the photo shoots, but I wasn't offered any moola 

for it.


> You can learn from him. Analyze your own sitiuations and then compare it to

> that of masters like Gabo. You wont starve and you will find plenty of time 

to spend with the

> ones who need you more than some lady that got screwed by some ISP on her 

business site


That lady by the way, never came to me. Once again, I offered and did it late 

at night while the kids were sleeping. I only sacrificed my own personal time. 

But you know, I don't see these acts as being profitless. Word of mouth goes so 

far. I just obviously live my life, not just my business by a different code 

than you do.


> My opinions come from a professional background and I know what protects the

> industry. Its obvious that your "self taught". Pro-bonos are gona happen for 

profitable

> organizations and more designers will be screwed. Our industry will suffer 

each time that

> happens. But as a designer community we can educate each other and learn from 

each

> others mistakes.

> Im sure some who have read this post have learned from yours.


My mistakes? Excuse me. I won't bore you with the boring details of my life, 

but I can tell you that I dragged myself out of the deep ditch that I dug for 

myself as a teen because of the circumstanses of my home life as a child.  On 

top of that, English leaving Quebec, selling all  etc... It has been a long 

haul. BUT, I taught myself how to paint....and now teach at large painting 

conventions, and have the opportunity to design books, when the time is 

allotted.


Do not for a moment think that I don't know what I am up against. I have no 

education to speak of. I have to fight even harder than you do because of that. 

My husband is in the same boat as far as education goes, but he has taught 

himself programming in many languages and can code in Authorware like there is 

no tomorrow.


All I can do is proove myself in my work. The things that I have done for free 

have brought me lots of business. In one year's time we will not be feeling the 

crunch anymore.


I really worded myself poorly in the other post and I most humbly appologize  

 for that. The past 2 years apart from building a business has also been 

furnishing a house, because we left Montreal 5 years ago as due to the 

situation (language), and sold everything we owned before we left. So I really 

screwed up with my words. We have been very busy rebuilding our lives.


I do believe and always will that the sucess that we are starting to experience 

is due to all that we have done for free. Things are not always cut and dry. 

There is a lot of grey between the black and white. Perhaps for a colledge 

educated professional, the road is straight and clear cut, but for those of us 

who took the hard knocks of life, we learn a different way. We have to work a 

lot harder to prove ourselves. I hope this doesn't start a war.


I have also been asked to do things for free that I have absolutely refused to 

do. I analyse everything and consider the pros and cons. I feel great about 

what I have done in a short amount of time and only see it getting better.


Judy Miller

Fall River Decorative Arts

http://fallriver.ns.ca |

judyfallriver [dot] ns [dot] ca (mailto:judyfallriver [dot] ns [dot] ca)

------------------------------------------------------------------------

To UNSUBSCRIBE send: unsubscribe flasher in the body of an

email to

list-managershocker [dot] com

.  Problems to:

ownershocker [dot] com

N.B. Email address must be the same as the one you used to subscribe.

For info on digest mode send: info flasher to

list-managershocker [dot] com